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ALSACAT is my comprehensive catalog of UFO sighting reports in Alsace, the region is the North-East of France, whether they are "explained" or "unexplained".

The ALSACAT catalog is made of case files with a case number, summary, quantitative information (date, location, number of witnesses...), classifications, all sources mentioning the case with their references, a discussion of the case in order to evaluate its causes, and a history of the changes made to the file. A general index and thematic sub-catalogs give access to these Alsatian case files.

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Case of Kientzheim, in 1480:

Case number:



In 1973, the authors of a ufology book thought it was fit to link the issue of UFO sightings with an alleged "apparition of the Blessed Virgin" in Kientzheim in 1480, ensuring that in a book about such events, she made "revelations in every way comparable to the best known revelations of Les Trois-Epis and La Salette."


Temporal data:

Date: 1480
Time: ?
Duration: ?
First known report date: 1480?
Reporting delay: Hours, months?

Geographical data:

Department: Haut-Rhin
City: Kientzheim
Place: ?
Latitude: 48.136
Longitude: 7.287
Uncertainty radius: 1 km

Witnesses data:

Number of alleged witnesses: 1
Number of known witnesses: ?
Number of named witnesses: 0
Witness(es) ages: ?
Witness(es) types: Clergy woman.

Ufology data:

Reporting channel: Ufology book Fernand Lagarde and LDLN group.
Type of location: ?
Visibility conditions: ?
UFO observed: Nos
UFO arrival observed: N/A
UFO departure observed: N/A
Entities: Yes
Photographs: No.
Sketch(s) by witness(es): No.
Sketch(es) approved by witness(es): No.
Witness(es) feelings: ?
Witnesses interpretation: Appearance and revelations of the "Blessed Virgin".


Hynek: N/A
ALSACAT: Religious inventions, not related to the question of UFO sightings.



Kientzheim (Guide, p. 360).

Apparition of the Blessed Virgin in 1480. She made the revelations in every way comparable to those of the best-known revelations of Les Trois-Epis and La Salette.



One may wonder why an alleged "appearance of the Blessed Virgin" appears in a ufology catalog.

I wonder about that myself. But since at least one source believes that this story is part of ufology, whatever the reason is, I also have to deal with it, to assess the meaning this "appearance the Blessed Virgin" case might have in connection with ufology, I need to see what this is all about before I can deny or accept the relevance of the story to ufology.

A part of the ufologists, usually those who consider the idea of extraterrestrial visitors false or stupid, blame others who do not agree to "ignore" or "silence" a range of "phenomena", such as the "apparitions of the Blessed Virgin." They consider that such events teach something to ufologists and that ignoring them is a methodological error, or a form of "closed mindedness" or even "stupidity".

So, they are wrong here, as I did not "reject" the matter without consideration, on the contrary, I looked for the best possible documentation on the case so that I can make a thoughtful assessment about it; and it is only after doing this that I state whether this case teaches something useful in ufology.

I should explain briefly to the possibly ufologically "novice" reader, the reasoning that some ufologists give to justify that a "Blessed Virgin appearance" would indeed be relevant to ufology. Many reasons are put forth, some of which are contradictory with the others. But they exist:

These are, in short, why visions of the "Blessed Virgin" are sometimes found in UFO literature.

Now what do we have regarding this 1480 Kientzheim case?

This was reportedly an apparition of the Blessed Virgin to a nun, with "revelations."

In 1466, the church of Kaysersberg, mother-church of Kientzheim, was burned during a war and only the statues of the "Virgin" and "Saint John" on either side of a large crucifix had been saved, and made safe in the church of Saints Felix-et-Régule in Kientzheim. A few days later, many people allegedly saw the two statues "crying tears" - one can obviously think of condensation of water vapor after the move. Subsequently, many miracles allegedly occurred, quickly attributed to the "Blessed Virgin" and a "revelation" actually claimed by Colinon to have been "comparable in all respects to those more familiar in Les Trois-Epis and La Salette."

As for the "revelations", impossible to find those made in Kientzheim, but the well-known revelations to the blacksmith Dietrich Schoeré in Les Trois-Epis were:

"See these wheat stems. They are the symbol of the abundance of good harvest which will reward the generous virtuous beings, and bring well-being and happiness in the homes of the faithful Christians. But this ice means that hail, frost, flood, famine, and all its attendant miseries and desolation will punish the disbelievers whose gravity of sins tired the divine mercy. Go, man, go down to the villages and announce to all the residents the meaning of these prophecies."

(Other versions are similar, it is usually a story about the blacksmith being given a mission to urge people to virtue, those who believed became healthy, disbelievers were "struck with infertility" or "died of pestilential diseases" naturally sent to them by "God".

The 1846 "revelations" to Mélanie Mathieu, a shepherdess of La Salette, were essentially:

"Melanie, I'll tell you something you will not tell anyone: time of the wrath of God has come. If, when you have told the people what I told you just now, and what I will tell you to say it again, if, after that, they do not convert, (if one does not do penance, and one does not stop working on Sundays, and if one continue to blaspheme the holy name of God), in a word, if the face of the earth does not change, God will take revenge against the ungrateful people of slaves of the devil. My Son will show his power! Paris, this dirty town with all sorts of crimes, will inevitably perish. Marseilles will be destroyed in a short time. When these things happen, the mess will be complete on earth. The world is wicked with passions. [...] After all these things occur, many people will see the hand of God, they will convert, and will repent from sins. The great king will ascend the throne, and reign for a few years. Religion will bloom and spread throughout the earth and fertility will be great, the happy world that will lack nothing will resume its disorders, forget about God, and will engage in their criminal passions. [...] The time is not far off, it will happen in less than twice 50 years."

I have a hard time to see that these revelations are "in every way comparable"...

What prompted Fernand Lagarde and the LDLN ufology group mention such things as UFO-related? In their book, they claim that there are "places relations" between UFO sightings and "mystical phenomena." for the 496 UFO sighting cases in Alsace I have noted, only one is located in Kientzheim, in 1955, but it was reported only in 2012, the authors therefore could not know about it. No cases in the area that would justify a "locations relationship" here. Especially since chance alone would obviously bring UFO sightings in places where religious claims were made, over time. And besides, shouldn't we consider only those events that would be really credible and of high strangeness?

The authors then say that another relationship is that of "miracle cures" that would be found with both in "mystical phenomena" and UFO sightings reports. I studied tens of thousands of cases of UFO sightings, the proportion of "miracle cures" is extremely tiny, and well below the number of cases with physiological damage to the witnesses, real or alleged, in UFO cases.

In Kientzheim, no less than 187 miracles were noted down - there are even "resurrection of the dead" - 162 of them occurred between 1467 and 1480, prompting an important pilgrimage. But after that date, the frequency drops sharply, and there none after 1507. It was wisely suggested that the chaplain who had noted down the miracle from 1475 to 1505 had lost his zeal, and that none of this is really credible...

As for the last argument noted by the authors, the so-called total identity of the revelations in Les Trois-Epis and La Salette and Kientzheim, we saw what it really was.

No, really, I do not see any reason to see a real "relationship" between the alleged "revelations of the Blessed Virgin" in Kientzheim in 1480 and the question of UFO sightings.


Religious inventions, not related to the question of UFO sightings.

Sources references:

* = Source is available to me.
? = Source I am told about but could not get so far. Help needed.

File history:


Main author: Patrick Gross
Contributors: None
Reviewers: None
Editor: Patrick Gross

Changes history:

Version: Create/changed by: Date: Description:
0.1 Patrick Gross August 20, 2014 Creation, [mcn1], [fle1].
1.0 Patrick Gross August 20, 2014 First published.

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This page was last updated on August 20, 2014.