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Roswell 1947 - Documents on the witnesses

Barbara Dugger

(Barbara DUGGER).

Please, before asking any question or sending any comment or criticism, read this.

Biography:

Barbara Dugger, a schoolteacher, is one of the two granddaughters of the late George Wilcox, Chaves County Sheriff in Roswell at the time of the incident.

George Wilcox family members involved in the affair:

George Wilcox: Chaves County Sheriff at the time of the incident.
Inez Wilcox: his wife.

Two daughters of George Wilcox:
Phyllis McGuire
Elizabeth Tulk - Her husband: Jay Tulk

Grandchildren of George and Inez Wilcox:
Barbara Dugger
Christine Tulk

Affidavits:


AFFIDAVIT

(1) My name is Barbara Dugger.

(2) My address is: [-]

(3) I am employed by: [-]

(4) My grandmother was Inez Wilcox, and my grandfather was George Wilcox, who was the Sheriff in Chaves County, New Mexico, in 1947. I live with my grandmother while I was teaching at the New Mexico Military Institute. I was 24 years old at the time.

(5) One evening, while we were watching a TV program about space, my grandmother told me that in the 1940s, there was a spacecraft -- a flying saucer -- that crashed outside Roswell. She told me not to tell anybody, because when the event occurred, "the military police came to the jailhouse and told George and I that if we ever told anything about the incident, not only would we be killed, but our entire family would be killed." I said, "Did you believe them?" she said, "What do you think? They mean it, Barbara, they were not kidding." She didn't remember the names of those involved, however, she said it was Air Force personnel who threatened them. She never told anyone else in the family about the event, even my mother, Elizabeth Tulk.

(6) She said someone had come to Roswell and told him about this incident. My grandfather went out there to the site; it was in the evening. There was a big burned area, and he saw debris. He also saw four "space beings". One of the little men was alive. Their heads were large. They wore suits like silk.

(7) After he returned to his office, my grandfather got phone calls from all over the world -- including England. MPs came to the jail. A lot of people came in and out of the jail at the time.

(8) She said the event shocked him. He never wanted to be sheriff again after that. Grandmother ran for sheriff and was defeated. She wrote an article about the event right after it happened to see if anyone else knew anything about it.

(9) My grandmother was a very loyal citizen of the United States, and she thought it was in the best interest of the country not to talk about the event. However, if she said it happened, it happened. Her state of mind was excellent at the time of this conversation. She was working in real estate. Grandfather had passed away by this time for hardening of the arteries. Grandmother passed away at the age of 93.

(10) I have not been paid of given anything or value for making this statement, which is the truth at the best of my recollection.

Barbara Dugger
(Signature)

2-24-95
(Date)

Signature witnessed by:
Veronica Garcia

This affidavit was published in Karl Pflock's book, "Roswell: Inconvenient Facts and the Will to Believe", in 2001.

Interviews and public statements:

Barbara Dugger, granddaughter of George and Inez Wilcox, is on a videotaped interview in Recollections of Roswell Part II in 1991:


My grandmother was Inez Wilcox and my grandfather was George Wilcox, he was Sheriff in Roswell, New Mexico, at the time of the Roswell incident.

Alright, and you say you lived with your grandmother?

Yes, I lived with her, well I lived with her one whole year and when I taught at the New Mexico Military Institute and I lived with her 3 years and then off and on. She helped finance me and support me, because she wanted me to go to College.

Did she ever discuss the Roswell incident?

One evening we were watching TV and on TV there was something about space and my grandmother looked over at me and she said "Barbara, do you believe in anything, you know, outside of the Earth?" and I said "you know I do", and she said "here is something that I'd really like to tell you, but I don't want you to ever discuss it outside and never tell anybody."

She just wrote an article one time and put "Flying Saucer" on it and all that's all she had ever written down on a piece of paper.

And I said "Fine, what do you need to tell me?" And I thought it was going to be something completely different than what she told me and she said in the forties, there was a spacecraft, a flying saucer, that's how grandma called it, that crashed outside of Roswell [?] and I said "[?] How do you know?" and she said "your Grandfather George was Sheriff at the time, and I said "well [?] What's more about it?" and she was very hesitant to talk about it but you knew this was in her, that she really needed to tell me and she said that quite a while [?] "I'm just going to tell you". But she said "Don't tell anybody and I said "who I am going to tell anyway, I don't know anybody to tell it and she said the reason [?] is because when the incident happened, the military police came to the court house, to the jailhouse, and told George and I that if we ever told anything of the incident, talked about it in any way, not only they would be killed, but the family, they would get the rest of the family.

She was there and witnessed the police [...]?

Yes, she was standing there with my grandfather. I said "Did you hear them say that?" and she said "Yes I did Barbara" and she said "That's exactly what they told me" and I said "Why? What did you know?"

And did she tell you what?

Yeah, I said "What could you have known?" What happened is, that my grandfather said they called my grandfather, somebody called on the telephone and [?]

In the jailhouse?

Yes they met in the jailhouse. And someone came and told my grandfather of the incident that had happened outside of Roswell. My grandmother said that my grandfather went out there, to the site. Once he got out there, there was a big burned area. When he first approached the area, and then he saw debris, he saw debris, and he was alone, she was not with him, he went by himself. She said it was kind of like in the evening and that when he came back, she asked, you know, out of jokingness, did he see space beings? And he said "yes, there were four of them", and I asked her, what did they [?]?

And she said they had, they were, like grey, that their heads were large, and the little suits they had on, you could, it was like er, silk or something, like that kind of material, they were gray, and I asked her "what happened after that?" and she said he came back into town and they, I guess they had discussed this incident, and they had thought it was fine to put it on to the news, to talk about it, and then, apparently, something happened and it was not okay.

And that's when he started... Grandma said he got phone calls from all over the world, England, people were calling him talking to him asking him about the situation, and that he had been [?] he had gone out there and he'd seen the site and seen the situation that they had talked about and Grandma said [?] "you really believe [?] You don't say anything, George, and if you do, you are dying and so are the children and [?]"

And I said "Did you believe it?" and she said "I believed it".

You know, when someone tells you... and they have fear in their voice, and you're talking to a person you really love and she was [?] and I believed her and I know she had been telling the truth. I knew she did and [?]

Investigators notes and comments:

Stanton Friedman and Don Berliner:

These researchers told that Kevin Randle interviewed Miss Barbara Dugger, granddaughter of George and Inez Wilcox. The sheriff had died when Barbara was quite young, but she lived with her grandmother while going to college and became very close to the elderly but still dynamic Inez Wilcox. According to Barbara, her grandmother said:

"Don't tell anybody. When the incident happened, the military police came to the jailhouse and told George and I that if we ever told anything about the incident, not only would we be killed, but our entire family would be killed!" They called my grandfather and someone came and told him about this incident. He went out there to the site; there was a big burned area and he saw debris. It was in the evening. There were four "space beings." Their heads were large. They wore suits like silk. One of the "little men" was alive. If she said it happened, it happened!

The grandmother said about the death threats:

"They meant it, Barbara—they were not kidding!" "She said the event shocked him. He never wanted to be sheriff again after that. Grandmother ran for sheriff and was defeated. My grandmother was a very loyal citizen of the United States, and she thought it was in the best interest of the country not to talk about it."

The researchers say Inez Wilcox died not long afterward, at the age of ninety-three.

Source:

Karl Pflock:

Karl Pflock said that according to her granddaughter Barbara Dugger, the Sheriff George Wilcox and his family were threatened at the time of the incident. Dugger learned it from her grandmother Inez Wilcox, who told her that "the military police came to the jailhouse and told George and I that if we ever told anything about the incident, not only would we be killed, but our entire family would be killed."

Further on, Pflock said that Barbara Dugger, granddaughter of Sheriff George Wilcox, and his wife Inez, testified that her grandmother told her the Sheriff "went out to the site; it was in the evening. There was a big burned area, and he saw debris. He also saw four 'space beings'. One of the little men was alive Their heads were large. They wore suits like silk."

He said this come from "Recollections" and from an affidavit on file at the Fund for UFO Research.

Further on, he said that in a March 1991 interview, Barbara Dugger, whose mother Elizabeth Tulk was the daughter of Sheriff George Wilcox and his wife Inez, alleged that decades after the incident, her grandmother told her the military visited her grandparents at the Sheriff's office and threatened that "if we (George and Inez Wilcox) ever told anything about the incident, not only would we be killed, but our entire family would be killed."

Pflock comment that this is a standalone claim, suspicious because both Dugger's mother and the Wilcox other daughter, Dugger's aunt Phyllis McGuire, told Roswell researchers about their memories of the incident. McGuire was in the Sheriff's office when the military arrived, and Tulk's husband Jay came soon after, and the Tulks and McGuire never said anything about death threats. McGuire only remembered that Inez Wilcox told her the Army asked the Sheriff not to say anything further about the incident. Journalist Jason Kellahin too told that when he tried to interview George Wilcox on july 8, "Wilcox said the military indicated to him it would be best if he did not say anything."

Pflock said Dugger's second-hand testimony is unsupported and lacking credibility, and was given weeks after the "Unsolved Mysteries" TV show about the Roswell incident broadcasted tales of harsh cover-up measures by the military.

Source:

Kevin Randle:

The author says that among the civilians who had information about alien bodies, there was Barbara Dugger, Sheriff George Wilcox's granddaughter. She said that someone came and told her grandfather "about this incident that happened outside Roswell" The grandfather went out there and when he got there, there was a big burned area, and he saw debris.

Dugger said her grandfather said there were four bodies: "They were, like gray, and grandfather said their heads were large and the little suits they had on were like silk or something... The little people were lying on the ground... She said I think one of them was alive.

Dugger said the site visited by Wilcox was about 30 miles outside of Roswell, that there was a big burned area and debris scattered around.

Dugger said her grandmother had written something about her experiences in the late 1940's, a part of an article about the time George Wilcox was the Chaves County sheriff and she was working in the jail as the matron.

Kevin Randle reproduces this; which said:

One day a rancher North of town brought in, what he called a "FLYING SAUCER", there had been many reports all over the United States by people claiming they had seen a FLIYNG SAUCER. The rumors were in many variations, the saucer was from a different planet, and the people flying on it, were looking us over. The germans had invented this strange contraption, a fromible weapon. Other tales, that one had landed and strange looking people all seven feet tall or more walked from it, but quickly departed on sighting any on looker. All the players played the stories up, and many people searched the skies at night to catch sight of one. Sine no one had seen a flying saucer, Mr. Wilcox called headquarters at Walker Air Force Base [new name of RAAF] and reported the find. Before he hung up the telephone almost, an officer walked in. He quickly loaded the object into a truck and that was the last glimpse any one had on it.

Simultaneously the telephone began to ring, long distance calls from Newspapers in New York, England, France Government officials. Military officials, and the calls kept up for 24 hours straight. However, the Officer who picked up the suspicious looking saucer, admonished Mr. Wilcox to tell as little as possible about it and refer all calls to Walker Air Force Base. A secret well kept, for to this day, we never found out if it was really a FLYING SAUCER.

Kevin Randle notes that this was an addition to the original article as if it was added at a later time. He notes Inez Wilcox dies a few years after the publication of the book "The Roswell Incident", and that there is no way to know if this was written prior or after the book's publication.

Source:

On his blog, Kevin Randle specifies that it was him and Donald Schmitt who interviewed Barbara Dugger, in early 1991.

Source:

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